Curse

Felessan · Sep 08, 2006, 10:47 AM // 10:47

Foo:

You seem to have two issues:
1. 55hp build (that can be used by any class)
2. bots

What I can make out of your posts is "the money THEY make"
If you want to remove the bots from the game >> sign

If you want to nerf the 55hp build >> not signed
other classes use 55 build as well without PS so it would be unfair tho the other 55builds because one class uses it the most.

elLOCOmutha · Sep 08, 2006, 10:49 AM // 10:49

/Signed

I think Anet needs to seriously start looking at some of the builds these people are using. Do they even play this game?

Nevin · Sep 08, 2006, 10:52 AM // 10:52

You seem very unknowledged, Ritualists can farm, Warriors can farm, Assassins can farm (to an extent). So why nerf only the Monks?...

Shadow Dragon · Sep 08, 2006, 11:09 AM // 11:09

To the point of the thread nerfing one skill does not just affect the build you are trying to get rid off but you also hurt quite a few other builds. nerf PS go ahead. but then you ruin pvp builds and eg. the boon prot build alot of people WANT for a full balanced group in FoW or UW. but then again you didn't really think about your argument properly now did you? didn't think so.

trialist · Sep 08, 2006, 11:20 AM // 11:20

Why go to all the trouble of nerfing the skills? Simply putting a nec with vamp gaze in all the popular farming spots and 55 botters would die overnight (but probably evolve to something else, botters will be botters and can't really be stopped). Most of the farmable spots are simply because of a lack of proper mixing of the classes, thus making that area vulnerable to a particular type of built, or class. I mean think about it, when you solo farm, what kind of mobs are you farming? I'll bet most of you would be going after mobs that are of a similiar class rather than mixed mobs, which are a lot harder to farm. If anet bothered to ensure that all areas had a proper mix of classes, the 55 monk would have never became popular, since it would have became a "got hit once and died" kind of built.

Chris Blackstar · Sep 08, 2006, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Buying money from e-bay is against the user agreement for this game, but that is only part of a much larger problem, that fact that monks get better drops then any other profession, but of course let's not look at that right now either.

The main cause to this problem is the current inflation in the game caused by players selling weapons for 100K+ectos that creates a need for fast money, that creates a need to make fast money through the use of bots, which creates a understanding to those who want to profit from others greed(A piece of the pie).

You want to stop bots, then stop the inflation. No one will want huge amounts of gold, if there is no where to spend it. Most of the players who have responded negativly to this thread are the direct cause of the problem, and as far as I see it, this is not a problem, because change is the enemy.

So in conclusion, nothing needs to be nerfed as far as characters or skills go, what needs to be nerfed is the current inflation in the economy that is causing the demand for gold(I hate to say this, but learn to live with it, Anet really cares, but also knows it would destroy the games economy as well as the game itself if they took action to stop the inflation.)

foo · Sep 08, 2006, 11:33 AM // 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Felessan

Foo:

You seem to have two issues:
1. 55hp build (that can be used by any class)
2. bots

What I can make out of your posts is "the money THEY make"
If you want to remove the bots from the game >> sign

If you want to nerf the 55hp build >> not signed
other classes use 55 build as well without PS so it would be unfair tho the other 55builds because one class uses it the most.

You are right, about the fact that there are two issues here, but still, closely related. I also guess I shouldn't have touched peoples' PS. scratch that, I'm talking of the stacking of same rune hp penalty. the main issue here is the trouble of botting, and their use of an exploit. I'm saying that even thou some people enjoy this exploit, the damage done by it is much more severe, and how is it said? "harsh times require hard actions". :] well it's time that anet will do something, and if it will cost me my 55 monk and mesmer, so be it.

The Herbalizer · Sep 08, 2006, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

Buying money from e-bay is against the user agreement for this game, but that is only part of a much larger problem, that fact that monks get better drops then any other profession, but of course let's not look at that right now either.

The main cause to this problem is the current inflation in the game caused by players selling weapons for 100K+ectos that creates a need for fast money, that creates a need to make fast money through the use of bots, which creates a understanding to those who want to profit from others greed(A piece of the pie).

You want to stop bots, then stop the inflation. No one will want huge amounts of gold, if there is no where to spend it. Most of the players who have responded negativly to this thread are the direct cause of the problem, and as far as I see it, this is not a problem, because change is the enemy.

So in conclusion, nothing needs to be nerfed as far as characters or skills go, what needs to be nerfed is the current inflation in the economy that is causing the demand for gold(I hate to say this, but learn to live with it, Anet really cares, but also knows it would destroy the games economy as well as the game itself if they took action to stop the inflation.)

Um the prices of in-game items are at an all time low. I take it you didnt play when inperfect common gold items would sell for 100k + which now are merch food. You can buy absolutely tons of perfect gold items for like 5-10k which once cost hundreds of thousands of platinum. Items were never cheaper than they are now. I suggest you learn about the history of the Guild Wars economy before making statements such what you have.

foo · Sep 08, 2006, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by trialist

Why go to all the trouble of nerfing the skills? Simply putting a nec with vamp gaze in all the popular farming spots and 55 botters would die overnight (but probably evolve to something else, botters will be botters and can't really be stopped). Most of the farmable spots are simply because of a lack of proper mixing of the classes, thus making that area vulnerable to a particular type of built, or class. I mean think about it, when you solo farm, what kind of mobs are you farming? I'll bet most of you would be going after mobs that are of a similiar class rather than mixed mobs, which are a lot harder to farm. If anet bothered to ensure that all areas had a proper mix of classes, the 55 monk would have never became popular, since it would have became a "got hit once and died" kind of built.

Right. another partial solusion would be to make the "dying nightmares" into "living nightmares", at an apropriate level and with some better skill. (who gave them bip?!?!) factions seems to be more balanced in that way. elona's minotaurs could use some help too.

Yichi · Sep 08, 2006, 11:45 AM // 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

...but that is only part of a much larger problem, that fact that monks get better drops then any other profession, but of course let's not look at that right now either.

ok seriously WTF are u smoking... i need some after reading this thread...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

The main cause to this problem is the current inflation in the game caused by players selling weapons for 100K+ectos that creates a need for fast money, that creates a need to make fast money through the use of bots, which creates a understanding to those who want to profit from others greed(A piece of the pie).

You want to stop bots, then stop the inflation. No one will want huge amounts of gold, if there is no where to spend it. Most of the players who have responded negativly to this thread are the direct cause of the problem, and as far as I see it, this is not a problem, because change is the enemy.

So in conclusion, nothing needs to be nerfed as far as characters or skills go, what needs to be nerfed is the current inflation in the economy that is causing the demand for gold(I hate to say this, but learn to live with it, Anet really cares, but also knows it would destroy the games economy as well as the game itself if they took action to stop the inflation.)

While i agree that certian things are overpriced in this game, totally dumping the economy of the game wont fix the problem either. Certian things ARE valued high and hold a higher resel value base on where the item comes from, the weapon, staff, shield, wand, or offhand skin it has, and the stats of the item itself. While yes most people know about collectors, traders, weaponsmiths... when you have played this game for a while and accumulated some money in this game, there are limited things to sepnd it on. either rare skinned weapons, dyes, or armors.

The problem is people comming into such game and seeing items and going OMFG I HAV TO HAV DAT !!!1 instead of thinking wait a second, maybe theres a weapon like it but cheaper that suits my needs until now. When youre 16, unless youre rich, you dont get a ferrari for your bday, you get a honda or something else that suits you until you can get yourself better.

AND COULD SOMEONE PLEASE KILL THIS HORSE!!!! im tired of seeing its rotten corpse beaten. seriously its not alive anymore. stop with the abuse...

foo · Sep 08, 2006, 11:54 AM // 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by MistressYichi

...im tired of seeing its rotten corpse beaten...

If you are tired, go to bed.

Chris Blackstar · Sep 08, 2006, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

Um the prices of in-game items are at an all time low. I take it you didnt play when inperfect common gold items would sell for 100k + which now are merch food. You can buy absolutely tons of perfect gold items for like 5-10k which once cost hundreds of thousands of platinum. Items were never cheaper than they are now. I suggest you learn about the history of the Guild Wars economy before making statements such what you have.

I suggest you take a ride over to LA, and or any other town and see for yourself what items are going for, look at my join date, I have been playing the game since the the second beta weekend, and the economy has only got worse since GW has come out. I remember when ectos where still set a 100G., do you?

The Herbalizer · Sep 08, 2006, 12:08 PM // 12:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

I suggest you take a ride over to LA, and or any other town and see for yourself what items are going for, look at my join date, I have been playing the game since the the second beta weekend, and the economy has only got worse since GW has come out. I remember when ectos where still set a 100G., do you?

Ectoplasms do not represent the whole economy. The vast majority of items/materials etc have lost alot of their value. You could also argue several of the monstrous materials have increased in value but again they do not represent the whole economy. Virtually every Tyrian and now many Factions items/weapons have lost value. Most mods are rediculously cheap i.e. 3/1 vampiric mods selling for 3k when once 75k.

I dont need to go to LA and see what items sell for as I have had months and months of trading experience which has accumulated me well over 10 million gold. I also have one of the best weapon collections in the game and I know for a fact the vast majority of it has lost alot of value.

Pro-Monk · Sep 08, 2006, 12:11 PM // 12:11

I get soooooooo tired of people asking Anet to swing the nerf bat on this or that because THEY don't like something. This game has continually gotten worse and worse as Anet keeps messing with things that aren't broke.

Getting "rid" of the 55 monk build, will not get rid of bots or reduce the amount of gold sold for real cash!!!!! The only way to do that is to nerf any kind of farming at all, which in effect, would kill the PvE end of the game.

Your real agenda seem to be aimed at the game's economy, which isn't solely affected by bots or purchased gold. Thank Anet if you don't like how the economy is going, they done enough to screw it up. Look at how worthless runes are due to ettin farming (which isn't farmed by 55 Monks). And now there seems to be a Aviacara rune farm build which I doubt is based on a 55 Monk. And who says that making everything "cheap" in the game is good? If everything can be purchased for 100g, where's the fun in that?

Anet has already done nerfing on the 55 Monk anyway. Phophet's Path griffon farming was totally nerfed for the 55 Monk build, which is where everyone complained of the bots operating. I totally agree with others that state the fact that getting rid of the 55 Monks will not stop botting. It will only serve to eliminate a legitimate farming build that's used by a lot of LEGITIMATE players.

I totally oppose any changes directed soley at the 55 Monk build.

Chris Blackstar · Sep 08, 2006, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by MistressYichi

ok seriously WTF are u smoking... i need some after reading this thread...

While i agree that certian things are overpriced in this game, totally dumping the economy of the game wont fix the problem either. Certian things ARE valued high and hold a higher resel value base on where the item comes from, the weapon, staff, shield, wand, or offhand skin it has, and the stats of the item itself. While yes most people know about collectors, traders, weaponsmiths... when you have played this game for a while and accumulated some money in this game, there are limited things to sepnd it on. either rare skinned weapons, dyes, or armors.

The problem is people comming into such game and seeing items and going OMFG I HAV TO HAV DAT !!!1 instead of thinking wait a second, maybe theres a weapon like it but cheaper that suits my needs until now. When youre 16, unless youre rich, you dont get a ferrari for your bday, you get a honda or something else that suits you until you can get yourself better.

AND COULD SOMEONE PLEASE KILL THIS HORSE!!!! im tired of seeing its rotten corpse beaten. seriously its not alive anymore. stop with the abuse...

Seriously you need to read in between the lines, and not every other word, or you would have seen that I suggested an outline cause, but also suggested that it is not really a problem that should be fixed, due to the negaitive outcome that changing it could bring about.

Lastly, nothing is worth more then 100K, I don't care how rare it is, set the example, don't profit by it.

devils cruelty · Sep 08, 2006, 12:20 PM // 12:20

i love solo farming its great i wa/mo farm all the time i find 55hp monks a great way of farming instead of jsut doing UW or FoW as u get better drops and it breaks away the pure healing role a monk does,

most ppl make all their money from farming, i do solo farm and FoW if i do solidly solo farm i cna make 50k in 2 hours maybe, ppl in my guild 55hp then can make way more but tht doesnt bother me i wish i had 55hp

btw yes things are overpriced, expecially perfect mod axes and swords i just get greens of bosses 2 get weps as im not gonna pay 100+ectos for a gold axe when i can get free from boss with same mods

wilderness · Sep 08, 2006, 12:23 PM // 12:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

I suggest you take a ride over to LA, and or any other town and see for yourself what items are going for, look at my join date, I have been playing the game since the the second beta weekend, and the economy has only got worse since GW has come out. I remember when ectos where still set a 100G., do you?

So what you're saying is everything is too expensive now? Rubbish. You can spend a few days farming or buying and selling and afford any of the 'standard' rare skins if you know what you're doing.

Gold weapons and Fow armor are not essential, you can buy armor with exactly the same stats for 1.5k, and greens/collecters items for next to nothing. These items are supposed to be a symbol of achievment, and a reward for those who have put the effort in
You make ecto cheaper and everyone starts running around in FoW wielding crystaline swordsand it all becomes completly redundant.

The point is: more expensive in GWs does not mean better. Every expensive item has a cheap counterpart. Items were designed from the start to make sure players that would never be able to afford the rarer items would not be left behind.

If you want the rarer items, put the effort in.

Chris Blackstar · Sep 08, 2006, 12:23 PM // 12:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

Ectoplasms do not represent the whole economy. The vast majority of items/materials etc have lost alot of their value. You could also argue several of the monstrous materials have increased in value but again they do not represent the whole economy. Virtually every Tyrian and now many Factions items/weapons have lost value. Most mods are rediculously cheap i.e. 3/1 vampiric mods selling for 3k when once 75k.

I dont need to go to LA and see what items sell for as I have had months and months of trading experience which has accumulated me well over 10 million gold. I also have one of the best weapon collections in the game and I know for a fact the vast majority of it has lost alot of value.

Well Congradulations on being the cause of the problem, this selling of gold did not happen overnight you know. It happened when traders like yourself would sell items for outragous prices, I would of only sold that mod at the time you sold it for 5 to 10K, because truely that was all it was really worth.

Players like you cause the better mods in drops to go up, to deflat your overpricing habits that were causing players to go and make bots to harvest gold to sell to others to buy your items.

Now maybe you can see that you and many like you caused the problem we are currently in, but don't complain, your rich because of it, I hope that all your money makes and items makes you happy, earned at others expense.

wilderness · Sep 08, 2006, 12:33 PM // 12:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

Well Congradulations on being the cause of the problem, this selling of gold did not happen overnight you know. It happened when traders like yourself would sell items for outragous prices, I would of only sold that mod at the time you sold it for 5 to 10K, because truely that was all it was really worth.

Players like you cause the better mods in drops to go up, to deflat your overpricing habits that were causing players to go and make bots to harvest gold to sell to others to buy your items.

Now maybe you can see that you and many like you caused the problem we are currently in, but don't complain, your rich because of it, I hope that all your money makes and items makes you happy, earned at others expense.

Stop being so bitter.

If you want rarer items, put the effort in and farm or learn to buy and sell.

If you don't care about rare items, then buy their cheaper counterparts.

I really don't see how you're being affected here.

bilateralrope · Sep 08, 2006, 12:34 PM // 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

I'd say the best option is to just reduce the stacking health penalties. It's good for Anet, non-bots, PvPers

Hello 55 eles (air, earth, fire, water, energy storage).

Quote:

Originally Posted by trialist

Why go to all the trouble of nerfing the skills? Simply putting a nec with vamp gaze in all the popular farming spots and 55 botters would die overnight (but probably evolve to something else, botters will be botters and can't really be stopped). Most of the farmable spots are simply because of a lack of proper mixing of the classes, thus making that area vulnerable to a particular type of built, or class. I mean think about it, when you solo farm, what kind of mobs are you farming? I'll bet most of you would be going after mobs that are of a similiar class rather than mixed mobs, which are a lot harder to farm. If anet bothered to ensure that all areas had a proper mix of classes, the 55 monk would have never became popular, since it would have became a "got hit once and died" kind of built.

The only part of factions I hear about people 55ing in is naphui quater. Everywhere else is defended against 55s. Besides with spirit bond as healing the 55monk build can work well up to 600hp, allowing it to work in areas with some life stealing as you dont die instantly, so you can recover from the lifesteal if there are enough non-lifesteal enemies around(in theory, I haven't tested it). This also means that removing the -50hp cesta will do nothing.

As others have said, if you remove one farming method you only stop the farming for a few days till the farmers get new characters up and running on the new farming builds. But if ANET knows the areas the bots usually farm, and how they do it, they can detect possible bots eaiser.

But the main reason why skill changes to stop 55 monks aren't introduced is the effects the changes will have on PvP.

Because of the -50hp cesta and the hp penalty stacking, I once came up with a theory about 55monks being intended on ANETs part. I can put the hp penalty stacking down to a quirk of the GW engine that wasn't worth doing anything about, but can't think of any other reason why the -50hp cesta exists. If someone questions this theory I won't defend it.